Hi Hope

24 07 2009

The following is a response to A message to young women by Hope. She posted a comment on Roissy’s blog, and I don’t think she really gets it. The thing I noticed about her post is that she gives a bunch of advice, commands really, to young women without any explanation as to why they should listen, let alone do as she says. I get the feeling that Hope wants girls to learn the lessons that she had to learn the hard way, but that could be a misread.

Now, I like to advise young men to avoid the military and not to get married. However, there is absolutely no talking a guy out of either of these things if he’s already made up his mind. The best I can do is scare the crap out of him. Reason will not work. Hell, that’s another piece of advice I like to give everyone – it is very difficult to change someone’s mind with reason. Sure, you can technically win a debate and perhaps persuade a third party, but almost all modern humans are immune to logic when it contradicts whatever the hell they feel like believing. Hope doesn’t even try that. She just tells people what to do. I don’t get that.

She’s telling girls to stay away from men who “play the field.”

Men will always find beautiful women attractive. But…

Is this really so regrettable? Men are attracted to attractive women and women are attracted to attractive men. How terrible is this? It seems to have served the species well once upon a time. Of course, this is unfortunate for unattractive people, but it is not a bad for women in general or men in general.

…upstanding men will take care of their women and family, and will not jeopardize their monogamous relationships for a quick fling. The trick is distinguishing between the honorable, loving and committed kind of men from the kind that only see women as sex objects.

There’s a false dilema here. It is quite possible to be upstanding and honorable without being monogamous or committed to anyone in particular. I don’t know exactly what it means to see women only as sex objects. My image of someone who sees women that way is a guy who fantasizes about women when he pleasures himself, but doesn’t seem to know how to interact with them in real life or that, like us, they’re people too. The player is less preoccupied with sex and may well enjoy interaction with the fairer sex for it’s own sake rather than as a means to an end, though not necessarily. Some, may well be sex addicts with little interest in the person they’re fucking, but I think many are more addicted to women themselves than anything else. I really take issue with the way she seperates men into the committed and the players, as if all single dudes are “playing the field”, like there something wrong with a guy who’s not in a serious relationship, never mind that the guy could have been totally committed to a woman who got bored with him and left him.

Some men base their morality on self-interest and believe that women are inherently inferior to men. They justify their views on women not with reason but with feelings sprung from their groins. Such men are opportunists. They prey on women who believe they have no personal worth outside of their physical appearance, and who will meekly submit to any man showing a bit of dominance and status.

Do not fall for them. Do not believe their lies.

Apparently, this is her description of a player. Pick-up, it seems, is necessarily some sort of immoral trickery, and to practice it is to see women as inferior. Certainly, there are ethically objectionable methods of picking up women, but the whole game is not automatically evil. God is not so cruel. At the most superficial level, pick-up is about lines, tricks, and gimmicks. Mainly it’s the skill of being attractive to women. At the deepest level, it’s almost a self-help thing – becoming a better version of yourself. The tricks are seen as a crutch.

Stay away from men who refuse to acknowledge that women have inherent worth outside of sex, who cannot see the inner beauty that exist within the tender, sweet, intelligent women who possess a great deal of personal depth.

Dear ladies, if a man only values you for sex, he’s clearly not a keeper. However, if all men only value you for sex, you’re not a keeper. Women are just as capable of being worthless as men, although the consequences are less severe. I sense some hostility toward the hot girls, as it apparently a virtue to be attracted to women who have all the positive traits that aren’t physical beauty.

She goes on, telling girls not to be slutty…

Ignore men who are so focused on outward appearances and who insist on all women putting out all the time. They mistake the world as a giant “meet them, use them and dump them” club.

[…]
Some men might want emotionless sex, but many women do not — many men do not either! Is sex important? Absolutely. But don’t settle for sex with men who just want to use you for your body.

Why not? I’m not arguing that girls ought to be sluts, but I really want to know why she thinks they shouldn’t.  What are the consequences?

She goes on telling girls to exercise and to learn how to cook clean, to not dress slutty, and to look for men who are not slutty and superficial.  Great! Wifey stuff!

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3 responses

26 07 2009
Kimberly

“Dear ladies, if a man only values you for sex, he’s clearly not a keeper. However, if all men only value you for sex, you’re not a keeper.” [Unfrozen Caveman], that is quite possibly one of the best things I have ever read in my entire life. So simple and honest.
As for this Hope lady, she is really quite remarkable at taking obvious common sense stuff and turing it into a profound statement of advice. Since she went through the trouble to really break it down for us vaginal folk, Ill give her some advice: Hope, go buy a vibrator and stick it in your mouth. That is all.

26 07 2009
unfrozencaveman

Well, now, that’s not very nice. Haha

27 07 2009
Kimberly

Well shucks, I don’t think it’s nice to male bash. So what, there are men that are preoccupied with physical appearance and are solely looking for sex. That’s their business and it doesn’t make them bad people, it just means that his intentions are not in line with what her’s might be should she be dating such a person. Get over it Hope and stop trying to make women believe that men are scum.

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